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Author Topic: Regarding the total disaster called ASC (request for reinstating the eLicenser)  (Read 7998 times)

Svenne

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Arturia has made a huge mistake, replacing a well-working copy-protection (eLicenser) system with a total disaster (ASC) that destroys it's users licenses! I have used the eLicenser for XX years with various software without any problems, what so ever. This includes some 7 years with Autria software.

During all these years I've just downloaded, installed any updates and continued working. With the latest updates I was forced to use Arturias new ASC protection system, which led to catastrophic failures! Of my 5 synths only 1 will launch. The rest claims that they are not activated while the ASC claims they are.

 Adrien: Global Moderator
"it seems that this solution was not giving a very good user experience to our users, some needing to change of Computers need to generate new activation, some have difficulties to resell, and we are not always able to help them."

Activate the license on an eLicenser which can then be moved between as many computers as you which. What could be easier? No need to fuss around with having a connection to the Arturia site. As a matter of fact, while I'm writing this my Internet connection is down (due to malfunctions at my ISP). I can still move my eLicenser dongle to another computer if need be. With ASC I'm stuck. On another note, I'm presently evaluating OSX 10.10. This means I have to go back and forth between operating systems. "Up to 5 activations at once, which should not be used simultaneously." As I interpret this, I need to deactivate and reactivate the licenses every time i move from one OS to the other! (The operating systems are installed on separate drives.) With the eLicenser dongle I just restart the computer. There's not even a need to move the dongle.

With regard to re-selling the license: Insert the two dongles in separate USB ports. open the "eLicenser Control Center" program. drag the license from one dongle to the other and the license is transferred! Much easier than messing about with deactivating/activating using a bunch of codes. And most importantly; when moved the license will work! With ASC it, most likely will not!

Adrien also states "As some of you may already know we have been using eLicenser for several years to protect our softwares from piracy." Is Arturia no longer concerned with protecting its software software piracy? Why else are they then making it easier for the pirates? It doesn't make sense!!! Hardware based copy protection systems (eLicenser) will always be "safer" than software based (ASC). Case in point, just do a Google search (or visit Pirate Bay) and you'll find pirated versions of most of the latest updates. Just within weeks of their release.

Which remind me of a friend of mine who bought Giga Studio, several years ago. Giga Studio employed a lousy copy-protection, that only cause problems and grief for their legitimate users, but did nothing to prevent piracy. My friend (it actually wasn't me, but a friend) then tracked down a pirate copy of the version of Giga Studio he had bought, with the copy protection removed/disabled. This worked perfectly!

It would really be a sad state of affairs if Arturia forced it's users to install pirated copies of their software in order to use what they've paid for, wouldn't it?

So it's clear that the ASC is in no way any improvement. As a matter of fact it's a huge worsening of the usability and reliability of Arturia software. This will, undeniably, lead to a downward spiral. Selling software that can't be used will lead to discontent by Arturias customers with a propensity for software piracy (fueled by a much weaker protection). This in turn will lead to loss of income for Arturia. Which will lead to fewer resources for development. And so one. I guess we all know where this might end. It has already happened to several software companies.

I would like to urge Arturia to reconsider and reinstate the copyprotection system that worked flawlessly (eLicenser). There is a saying "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" and I might add "definitely don't replace it with something that's broken"! Those users who want to continue using Arturias excellent V-series synths, with a working problemfree copy-protection system, please join this request!

kickwizard

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Wow your not happy

I will be honest i was happy with the elicencer but many where not

It took alot of support time and was relient on a 3rd party (steinberg)

Also its possible arturia had to send there software to stienberg to get checked and signed off

ASC is supposed to increase update frequency and give users more freedom

In theory this seems a good idea and from Arturia's point they got to make it work and for me its working

My advice read the FAQ and contact support if needed to get your instruments functioning and authorised
« Last Edit: December 10, 2014, 06:32:47 pm by kickwizard »

Svenne

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"Wow your not happy"
You're absolutely correct! Having manufacturers destroying perfectly working software has a tendency to **** me off.

"It took alot of support time and was relient on a 3rd party (steinberg)"
I've never had to spend a second of support-time caused by the eLicenser. I've wasted hours, only the last three days, on ASC caused problems though. Without any solution in sight. Perhaps you are right. Arturia has fallen in the NIH (not invented here) trap.

"Also its possible arturia had to send there software to stienberg to get checked and signed off"
I don't know how the relationship works, but Arturta has used the eLicencer for a decade, almost. If the relationship was such a burden, wouldn't they have switched years ago?

"ASC is supposed to increase update frequency and give users more freedom"
That may have been the intention. However, if that is the case, they have failed miserably. The only thing they've accomplished is making their software unusable. You may regard being prevented to use the software you've bough and paid for. I don't!

"In theory this seems a good idea and from Arturia's point they got to make it work and for me its working"
A good idea can jump up and bite you with sloppy execution. Artura seems incapable of administering the ASC system. ASC has prevented me from using the instruments I own. I've been given one activation codes that doesn't work. I'm not alone in having problems. I've seen postings from people who has paid hundreds of Euros for software and received no activation codes at all. With eLicencer protected software, I've always received the code withing seconds of paying for the software.

Here are lots of reasons for Arturia to reinstate eLicencer protection http://forum.arturia.com/index.php?topic=83575.0 None of these users would have had any problems with eLicenser.

"My advice read the FAQ and contact support if needed to get your instruments functioning and authorised"
The FAQ doesn't tell me what to do when the ASC don't work. I've been in contact with the support. Apart from getting some activation codes (needed to transfer my eLicenser licenses to the ASC), of which one wasn't working, I've been ignored. So, if you excuse me, that advise wasn't worth very much.
« Last Edit: December 10, 2014, 09:36:42 pm by Svenne »

kickwizard

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I didnt care which protection they use

I havent used elicencer for that long and havent used any support time for it

I dont understand why there was so many forum posts for problems and complaints about elicencer but there was

For me it was a simple system for others either they didnt like having a dongle or registration issues

There was also complaints of not getting activation codes

I dont know how there relationship worked  with steinberg but the point that Adrien made that i was interested in is
updates can be released more frequently and on demand

Only time will tell if that works out

You didnt give any details in your first post about reading the FAQ or contacting support
and i did say if needed

There is troubleshooting information in the FAQ it just couldnt help you

As bugs and workrounds appear it should be be updated

Basically i was being polite and trying to be helpful and understand your point of view and issues

Your request is you want support for the devs to stop what there doing and trash what they been working on for the
last 6 months and rebuild all updates with a protection system they think is more time consuming

So no i dont support your request they should bugfix the ASC and work on the updates

MUSH MUSH Mushi

Svenne

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"Your request is you want support for the devs to stop what there doing and trash what they been working on for the
last 6 months and rebuild all updates with a protection system they think is more time consuming"
Please read my posts. I've said no such thing. I request that Arturia continue supporting a protections system that they've used and that is tried, tested and working. You may enjoy to pay for products that you are not allowed to use. I assure you, there are plenty of users that don't!

"So no i dont support your request they should bugfix the ASC and work on the updates"
So why are you wasting our time then. I invited people who see the problems with the ASC and wish to try doing something about it. If you prefer to use a weak, broken protection system that only benefit software pirates. Be my guest. I, and I am sure, several others don't. As I've already said: If it's not broken, don't fix it. And definitely don't replace it with something that's broken!!!

Adrien

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Hello Svenne,

To make it simple, you say "don't break something that worked"
Sorry to disappoint, it may have been working for you but the average issue rate was huge (around 1 issue / customer).

We had to spend huge amount of time in client support for no benefit (i.e. not fixing issues about MIDI nor audio, just about protection system).
The issue rate is right now 5 time less than before (and obviously we are at the point where a lot of people have to move to the ASC which makes it complicated for them, which I understand too).
Now the ASC is also use full to use on up to 5 machines your softwares, which a lot of users wanted,
You don't get error after upgrading your harddrive or changing OS.
If you need to use it offline, the ASC can do it, just click on offline mode when it loads.
And if you get errors, our support can help you fast, because we (Arturia) have the control of the license system.
Before, when we needed new codes, or to help reselling, we had difficulties that make our anwers to the musicians longer.
Finally you get the updates simply (and in future we will add features for beta testers and crash reports)

Now you were happy with eLicenser, and you don't want to change... then don't update your softwares if you want.
Everything that existed still work.

For the ASC, if you have issues, I'm really sorry about it,
please tell me what is your issue and we will just fix it (use a PM to make sure I see it, or PM Ben).

Best
« Last Edit: December 11, 2014, 07:50:03 am by Adrien »
Adrien Courdavault
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Svenne

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”the average issue rate was huge (around 1 issue / customer).”
Then Arturia must have done something seriously wrong with the way you handled the eLicencer system. As I’ve said, I’ve been using eLicencer  since 2002 (when it was launched) for software from several vendors (including Arturia). In all that time I have never heard of a single instance where anyone has had problems with authorising a licence on an an eLicencer dongle, that could not be contributed to user error. Most often the user has bought the wrong update version.

Furthermore I’ve never heard of anyone receiving a faulty authorisation code with the eLicense. Or worse, receiving no authorisation code at all!

Your statement, of around 1 issue / customer, is simply not credible, but a gross exaggeration. If there was as many issues with the eLicencer system, it would have been dead and buried a decade ago.

”The issue rate is right now 5 time less than before (and obviously we are at the point where a lot of people have to move to the ASC which makes it complicated for them, which I understand too).”
First; how can you make such a statement when the ASC system only has been available for a couple of weeks? Second; considering the amount of postings from people who has problems with the ARC, that figure is clearly not credible.

”Now the ASC is also use full to use on up to 5 machines your softwares, which a lot of users wanted,”
I doubt that these users wanted to be able to run 5 instances in theory, but 0 (zero) in practice.

”You don't get error after upgrading your harddrive or changing OS.”
Maybe not, but you do get an error when you try to run an activated application.

”If you need to use it offline, the ASC can do it, just click on offline mode when it loads.”
Well, since it can’t be used at all, this is also quite inconsequential. Isn’t it?

”Finally you get the updates simply (and in future we will add features for beta testers and crash reports)”
With the eLicenser I downloaded the update, installed it and continued working. That is easier than with the ARC system. Furthermore, there was no risk of loosing the license in the update process.

What does it take to get you to acknowledge the fact that the ARC system doen’t work!! It may be an acceptable idea, in theory, but in the real world (where the rest of us live) it’s a disaster.

”then don't update your softwares if you want”
So, it’s your way or the highway. I wonder what a court of law would have to say about such business practices. Arturia is legally obliged to make sure that the marketed products are operational. Knowingly sell products that don’t work may even open up the risk of criminal prosecution. I hope we’re not there yet, but if Arturia continues to sell defective products and ignores it’s customers requests for help, you are running a great risk. I find your statement insulting and offensive. It’s the kind of attitude I would expect from an an unethical buisnis that was only interested on fleecing money from their customers. Is that how you wish to describe Arturia these days?

What are my problems, you ask. One of the codes I received when I was forced to migrate from the eLincenser to the ARC is invalid. I can’t even register, much less activate it! Of the other 5 synths, only one works! The Arturia support has so far ignored my repeated requests for help!

With the eLicencer I had working licenses for  6 synths. After switching to the ARC, I have only one! For the rest, the ARC claims they are activated, while the individual apps claim they aren’t. Arturia/ARC has, for all intents and purposes, robbed me of 5 licenses!

I had planned on ”topping up” with the 5 ”missing” V-synths. Actually, since there appears to be no upgrade path, it would be cheaper to buy a V Collection 4 licence and sell the old ones. However, you have forced me to postpone those plans indefinitely. Would you give €399 to a company when; a) you weren’t sure you’d receive the necessary authorization codes at all, b) if you did receive the codes, that they worked and allowed you to register/activate the software, c) if you could activate the software, you still ran an 80% risk of not being able to use it, d) if you weren’t able to use it, you’d be ignored by the support. That’s the kind of risks anyone buying Arturia software today takes and is obviously totally unacceptable.

Add to that your ”my way or the high way” attitude, if that is official policy!
« Last Edit: December 11, 2014, 12:55:51 pm by Svenne »

Adrien

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Hello again,

So if I understand you have 1/6 products running ok only, while all are marked activated in the ASC.
Could you please give me the plugin version, and in which format and what DAW you use those?

Again, we would be really happy to solve your issue (because we can, thing that was not true always with eLicenser).

Now about the rest,
- no sadly we are not exagerating when I say 1/customer (this is an average on 2 years)
- It has been a short time, but this is when you launch a product that you have the highest issue/customer rate (so it is likely to come down)
- No there is no "our way or the high way" idea. Just to so I know, what company provides several concurrent version of the same plug in with various protection system? Yes eLicenser was creating issues for us, and the loading time was slower too.
Finally, going back to eLicenser would be saying "the high way" to all those who had issues, and are happy.
We thought very long about changing of protection (5 years) and spent 1 year to make this change. And even if we know this is difficult we had to do it.

Best
Adrien Courdavault
DSP & Software engineer
Arturia

Svenne

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So if I understand you have 1/6 products running ok only, while all are marked activated in the ASC.
Not quite. 4 won't launch, despite the ARC claiming they are activated. 1 cant be registered at all. Due to me being given invalid codes. 1 appears to work.

Details has been sen via PM: "Non-working synths". Refer to my previous PM "The ARC disaster" for information on where to locate screendumps (since you asked about which synths and their versions, I can only assume that you haven't read this.)

which format and what DAW you use those?
I have only concentrated on trying to make the standalones to work so far. But I will use the VST and AU plugins with Cubase and Garageband respectively.

I see no point in continuing the discussion of the ARC disaster. You have made you mind up that everyone who have problems with it are wrong. Just remember, when Arturia start loosing income due to dissatisfied customers and increased software piracy. You brought it on yourselves.

Just one note. "We thought very long about changing of protection (5 years) and spent 1 year to make this change.". Yet you managed to make such a mess of it. That is almost an achievement in itself.

Perhaps you can answer another question. When will we see VST3 versions of ARP 2600, CS-80, Jupiter-8, Mini, Modular & Prophet. I had expected this with the recent overhaul, but apparently not. Artuias excellent synths definitely deserves the VST3 treatment.

The fact that the ARC is a disaster, doesn't take away from the excellent quality of the V-series instruments. It's a great shame that the ARC prevents us from using them.

Adrien

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Hello

Your issue should be solved now.
Can you try again and confirm.

You had old licenses which had no unlock code, and this was the issue, you now have unlock codes (that you can read in your my arturia)

Best
Adrien Courdavault
DSP & Software engineer
Arturia

Svenne

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Your issue should be solved now.
Can you try again and confirm.
It appears that you've managed to fix one on them (Prophet V2). The others ARP 2600 V2, CS-80 V2 and Mini V2 still don't work. They still claim to be not activated while the ARC says they are.

Also the serial and activation code for Jupiter-8 V2 still comes up as invalid. (and this it can't be registered or activated).

Sorry. You appear to have gotten one to work, but that's it.

Mathieu Arturia

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Hello,

You might need to go in the ASC, in the settings tab, and click on "Deactivate All", then re-activate each plugin.

Can you tell me if that worked ?

Svenne

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Thanx. That seems to clear up the "activated" problem. I have just checked if they launch properly, and they do. I have to do more thorough testing tomorrow.

Now all that's left is the serial/activation problem with Jupiter-8 V2.

Adrien

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Hello i sent you a pm for that.

best
Adrien Courdavault
DSP & Software engineer
Arturia

Svenne

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Well, the forced migration from a working copy-protection system (eLicencer) to ARC has been fraught with problems.

It took 5 days to get the working licenses for 4 of my 6 instruments to activate properly.

EDIT: Now the Jupiter-8 V appears to be solved, so that took 8 days.

Pierre-Antoine appears to have closed the support ticket without resolving the issue(s) in question.

All my attempts to contact the support has this far been ignored. With the sole exemption of the first request.

Both you and I have been forced to waste time on issues that should have been resolved directly by Pierre-Antoine

So, how do you suggest Arturia compensate me for all the problems and surplus labor I’ve been forced to suffer because of this forced migration and lack of response from the support. A suggestion has been PM’d to you.
« Last Edit: December 15, 2014, 05:51:43 pm by Svenne »

 

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