Analog Lab and Reason - Instrument not saved when opening project

[sundar]

Hi guys,

Apologies if I'm using the wrong terminology or asking a repeat question (due to not fully knowing the correct terminology when searching).

I use Reason 10 with Analog Lab 4, now 4.1 and a Keylab mII.

I load Analog Lab as a VST in reason and make a track, but since updating to 4.1, it seams to have reset the VST in all my projects so all my Analog Lab instruments are pianos and organs when I open them now, instead of the instrument/patch I'd selected.
In the patch display on the VST it used to say "Init Patch" even after selecting the instrument I'd like to use from the Analog Lab interface. But now it reads "ProgramChange1" of which there are many to choose from and seem to have their own instruments pre-assigned.

Please ask for clarification if it sounds like I've butchered this explanation.

[LBH]

Hi and welcome to Arturia forums.

I don't have Reason. I'm on Windows 10.

In the patch display on the VST it used to say "Init Patch" even after selecting the instrument I'd like to use from the Analog Lab interface. But now it reads "ProgramChange1" of which there are many to choose from and seem to have their own instruments pre-assigned.

I think you mean in the VST wrapper and not Analog Lab VST it self. Please correct me if i'm wrong.

It look like the Concert lists preset is now in the DAW header. But unless you use ProgramChange or use the wrappers header to change presets, then it should not change anything. At initial load it should be the preset you had, when you saved the project, that is loaded.
Are you sending ProgramChange messages one way or another? Are you using Concerts so they are mixed up?

Can you be more specific in what you mean, and what you do?
Images can allways help to explain. So can you please post an image of the VST and the wrapper?

I have only made a small test yet. If this indeed is a technically issue, then i suggest you contact Arturia support.

[sundar]

Would "wrapper" refer to the interface within Reason/DAW? Which I then press the "open" button. This then opens a new window with Analog Lab in it. The VST itself?
Sorry for being confused on these bits, I know it makes it harder to visualise my issue.

I believe you may have helped to solve this.
Each time I loaded the loaded the DAW, it seemed to change all my Analog Lab VST settings to a pre-loaded concert which had appeared after upgrading to Analog Lab 4.1
I'd deleted this concert multiple times, but it would re-appear. It seems to be making all my DAW instruments into the instruments from that concert.

In trying to test this problem more thoroughly to clarify for you I deleted all the songs in the concert instead of deleting the concert/playlist itself, and now my projects load with the previously selected patches.

[LBH]

Would "wrapper" refer to the interface within Reason/DAW? Which I then press the "open" button. This then opens a new window with Analog Lab in it. The VST itself?

I don't recall what it's called either. But yes it's the window that your DAW have for each of the plugins you load, that i called a wrapper. It may have some functionality used for the plugin. The plugin is inside that window.
The main thing is we come to a common understanding, about what we are talking about.

Each time I loaded the loaded the DAW, it seemed to change all my Analog Lab VST settings to a pre-loaded concert which had appeared after upgrading to Analog Lab 4.1
I'd deleted this concert multiple times, but it would re-appear. It seems to be making all my DAW instruments into the instruments from that concert.

In trying to test this problem more thoroughly to clarify for you I deleted all the songs in the concert instead of deleting the concert/playlist itself, and now my projects load with the previously selected patches.

If this is true, then something is going on. Are you sure, that you are not sending out ProgramChange messages from somewhere? Perhaps your DAW is set to send a message for each track? This seems to me to be what's going on, unless there is a technical issue.
You should not have to delete concerts. I don't think there is a new Arturia concert, but there still is the old demo concert.

[LBH]

Perhaps i should add, that when not using concerts, then you shall change presets in ALs own browser. I'm not sure how you have done.

[sundar]

I actually don't know if the demo concert was there before as I'd never used the feature.
I change presets in AL's browser as the only way I know how.

It certainly seems to be an issue with concerts. Just created a new concert with two instruments.
Every project I open now has those instruments instead of the ones I'd originally chosen for that track.
Deleting the songs/concert then reopening the projects then reverts them back to the originally chosen instruments.

There is this change since updating to AL4.1 in the display on the wrapper saying "ProgramChange1" instead of "InitPatch" resetting momentarily changes it to read "InitPatch" then it quickly changes back to "ProgramChange1".
I'm not sure what program change messages really are or where they can be sent from but it does seem to be the case.
This above test was done with the Keylab.mkII switched off to see if it was a midi signal from the hardware but still the same the same result.

What can be sending program change messages?

[LBH]

This above test was done with the Keylab.mkII switched off to see if it was a midi signal from the hardware but still the same the same result.

Good you did this. That seems to rule out a ProgramChange come from your controller.


Your DAW or some other plugin or some kind of script in your DAW might send out ProgramChanges to your tracks. But i don't use Reason, so i can't tell you how. If your tracks by default have a ProgramChange automation lane added, then that perhaps is responsible for the behavior.
But right now, i can't rule out there is a technical issue.

Perhaps i find out more, when i get to my main music PC and use my controller.

[LBH]

Nothing to add after i have been on my main PC.

Have you checked, if you have ProgramChange automation lanes active?

If it's not about ProgramChange, then i suggest you contact Arturia support through your account.

[sundar]

The workaround of having empty concerts/presets works for me for now, as it's not a feature I've explored, thanks for pointing me in that direction.

As for programchange automation, I can't figure out what could be doing that, nor see an automation lane for it. Usually Reason would highlight automation but I can't see any indication.
For now, i'm writing it off as an odd conflict between Reason 10 and Analog Lab 4.1

Thanks again for taking the time to talk through this with me, and for you're patience as I described the thingies and whatsits.

[LBH]

Your welcome.

I hope Arturia see this anyway and check it.

[mikael.onsilva@gmail.com]

Just to add to it, I'm having the same problem using it with Ableton.

I'll try the solution later and see if it solves the issue either.

[Nisky]

Similar problem in Ableton. So when re-opening a project, Analog Lab instruments default to ProgramChange1 which is linked to Concert Mode. Therefore in Ableton (scenes screen) at the bottom left hand corner I've found that before saving a project containing any A.Lab instruments just alter them to ProgramChange128 and when you re-open the project everything is as it should be. It's a work around but not ideal as if you're fully endorsed with concert mode and have 128 sounds loaded in when opening a project the instruments will default to whichever sound is loaded into a Concert Mode slot
I think what has occurred is that previous to the 4.1 update the bottom left hand corner box in Ableton said "none" and the only options now available are ProgramChange1 - 128 which seem to link to Concert mode .

Hope this makes sense.

[aeonblue78]

Deleting the concert demo in AL seemed to have worked for me. Ableton live was not loading the saved AL sounds until I did this. I deleted the concert demo and made a new one with 2 songs in it.

[kalleaa]

I am having a similar problem with Ableton 10 after updating to Analog Lab 4. When I open a project with saved AL4 presets, it loads the same "Piano & Keys: Piano grand" every time. The preset font is yellow, which means it is in concert mode if I am correct. How to disable the concert mode and get my original preset back?

[JackJackdaw]

I just encountered this bug using AL in Reason. I was horrified! My awesome synth track had defaulted to  crappy pianos! Luckily I had saved my patches and could recall them. I hesitate to use AL in a project again. I'm going to report it to Arturia.