LAYERS OF KNOB CONTROL IN CONTROL MODE, 16 PRESETS ?

[jsmirk]

My experience with the knobs is that they can be jumpy.  This can make sequencing a bit frustrating at times.  The knobs have a soft "click" as you turn them so that, in theory, you can adjust the note values by one semitone at a time.  However, this movement is not 100% reliable - sometimes I rotate the knob by one "click" and the note jumps by 2 or 3 semitones.  I've found that I have to watch my MIDI data in Logic to be sure I'm dialing in what I intended, unless I'm merely looking for a happy accident.

[djmental]

My experience with the knobs is that they can be jumpy.  This can make sequencing a bit frustrating at times.  ...- sometimes I rotate the knob by one "click" and the note jumps by 2 or 3 semitones. 

Yeah, that's exactly what I've read in other forums. But I didn't know that it also affected sequencer mode.
Most people seem happy with the knobs in sequencer mode, its as a controller for plugins that they find it unusable.

I suppose you have the fast setting for knob acceleration, right ? Apparently the Slow (Off) setting is unusable.
 Have you tried the medium setting ?

[stuey]

I dont know why you say its like comparing apples and oranges because Arturia has promoted this product both as a sequencer and as a controller.

Regarding the comparison between the beatstep and one of the launch pad/control devices. One has faders and a few small buttons, a midi mixer if you will (they aren't big enough to be called pads) the other is specifically designed as a scene controller for live, again buttons not exactly pad sized but you could I suppose get away with using it on such a way. Beatstep has decent sized pads and is a CV/Midi sequencer. They are 3 different products and thus cannot really be compared, hence apples & Oranges

The Novation sample control on the other is almost identical to the beatstep albeit without the sequencer. 

youre of the few that consider that the Beatstep has a good knob response as a midi controller. Everybody else seems to find something wrong with it.

You mentioned one guy was unhappy with the control but that's hardly everybody. The best thing you can do it to go and use them, go to your local music shop who has them in stock and plug them in and get hands on with them, you'll soon find out which one's you get on with and moreover, the ones you don't get on with.

I wouldn't advise anyone to just go on user feedback alone, nor to just get on google and get something delivered based on a few reviews.

Hope you get something you are happy with

Cheers, Stuart   

[stuey]

My experience with the knobs is that they can be jumpy.

Have you tried using different control terms, circular Vs Linear etc. But also this will happen with all midi controllers to a certain extent. If you move all the knobs so that they have focus on the app, i.e. no further differences are detecting by the know; do they jump?

There is always going to be a jump when opening up a new preset or application as knobs aren't always in the right place, this is the inherent problem with midi control such as this. 


Cheers, Stuart

[stuey]

However, this movement is not 100% reliable - sometimes I rotate the knob by one "click" and the note jumps by 2 or 3 semitones.  I've found that I have to watch my MIDI data in Logic to be sure I'm dialing in what I intended, unless I'm merely looking for a happy accident.

When you first touch the knob it will give you the sound that the current midi CC is set to, even if turned. This is because older gear CC numbers can only be set up by ear.

I do find that it jumps 1 or 2 semitones it's not 100% reliable like that, but once i find the sound I want, I leave it. It's not like you need to move those during a performance. That's what the presets are for.

Cheers, Stuart 

[jsmirk]

However, this movement is not 100% reliable - sometimes I rotate the knob by one "click" and the note jumps by 2 or 3 semitones.  I've found that I have to watch my MIDI data in Logic to be sure I'm dialing in what I intended, unless I'm merely looking for a happy accident.

When you first touch the knob it will give you the sound that the current midi CC is set to, even if turned. This is because older gear CC numbers can only be set up by ear.

I do find that it jumps 1 or 2 semitones it's not 100% reliable like that, but once i find the sound I want, I leave it. It's not like you need to move those during a performance. That's what the presets are for.

Cheers, Stuart

Yes I'm aware the first click is the current value.

So, ya it doesn't behave as is expected. Of course once you "find" the sound you want the sequence runs, yay. But I would argue that there should be no jumpy hit and miss "finding" to deal with. Often I'm counting the semitones as I move a note to a fifth of the previous, but it just skips over it and I have to look in my DAW to see what the note actually is. Slows down the workflow because it's unpredictable. Unfortunately I don't have a trained ear for recognizing exact notes.

Beatstep certainly works, and it's a nice piece of kit. I use it literally all the time. But i can't say it's a "joy" - mostly because of this one issue. Hopefully, for the people  in line for the Pro,there is some improvement to the encoders.

[stuey]

But I would argue that there should be no jumpy hit and miss "finding" to deal with.

In a perfect world you would be bang on correct.

Cheers, Stuart

[djmental]

Regarding the comparison between the beatstep and one of the launch pad/control devices. One has faders and a few small buttons, a midi mixer if you will (they aren't big enough to be called pads) the other is specifically designed as a scene controller for live, again buttons not exactly pad sized but you could I suppose get away with using it on such a way. Beatstep has decent sized pads and is a CV/Midi sequencer. They are 3 different products and thus cannot really be compared, hence apples & Oranges
The Novation sample control on the other is almost identical to the beatstep albeit without the sequencer. 

I think youre very confused about Novation products. I mentioned it once but I'll repeat it here: Im just comparing the Beatstep to the LaunchCONTROL, NOT the LaunchPAD, not the LaunchCONTROL XL.

Both the BeatStep and the LaunchCONTROL cost $99. Both are promoted as Midi controllers (and as a sequencer in the case of the Beatstep).
Look at all Arturia videos of the Beatstep and youll see that they consider the BeatStep a sequencer AND a midi controller, hence what I say they are not "apples and oranges".

Adding to this fact, not few people in this same forum and in Amazon have noticed both products and have considered buying the Beatstep because of the sequencer and better build quality. So I'm not alone in noticing the Beatstep midi controller capabilities.

You mentioned one guy was unhappy with the control but that's hardly everybody. The best thing you can do it to go and use them, go to your local music shop who has them in stock and plug them in and get hands on with them, you'll soon find out which one's you get on with and moreover, the ones you don't get on with.

Maybe then I just noticed one person complaining about the knob control. Since then I've found many, TWO in this very same post.
And you can look for posts on the subject to see that people are not yet satisfied with Arturia firmware solution for the knobs.
Although there have been suggested solutions by forum users since Arturia appears to be deaf on the issue.
To Arturia it appears that the problem is "solved".

I cant go to my local music shop in my country cause they don't have neither of these products. Almost every time I have to pay considerable shipping to get these kind of products. That's why I ask so much.

[djmental]

To moderators:

Did I say something wrong ?

[Santoman]

I dunno, man, if you made you decision or not, I will tell to all the others anyway:  I didn't notice your thoughts about the thing, that all limited knobs (such as I have in Akai MPK25) in their own way remember the last parameter position, so, if you change your midi channel and try to change value of another parameter it jumps from the previously value and makes sound become an awful mass of annoying jumps. Arturia beatstep was a real salvation for me in the way that it doesn't have physical or digital memory (just need to settle parameter on Relative# in Midi Control Center) von Live presets and now I'm really happy to create my Live sets, cuz, btw pads are also very helpful with that thing.
p.s. Knobs sensitivity is not a problem, it's just the matter of time when you train your fingers to move wise and fast enough (e.g. it's enough of one quick turn to go from 0 to 127, only a matter of mastery)

thnx for your attention, I know it would be useful for many of you, fellas, good luck ;^)

[jsmirk]

I dunno, man, if you made you decision or not, I will tell to all the others anyway:  I didn't notice your thoughts about the thing, that all limited knobs (such as I have in Akai MPK25) in their own way remember the last parameter position, so, if you change your midi channel and try to change value of another parameter it jumps from the previously value and makes sound become an awful mass of annoying jumps. Arturia beatstep was a real salvation for me in the way that it doesn't have physical or digital memory (just need to settle parameter on Relative# in Midi Control Center) von Live presets and now I'm really happy to create my Live sets, cuz, btw pads are also very helpful with that thing.
p.s. Knobs sensitivity is not a problem, it's just the matter of time when you train your fingers to move wise and fast enough (e.g. it's enough of one quick turn to go from 0 to 127, only a matter of mastery)

thnx for your attention, I know it would be useful for many of you, fellas, good luck ;^)

I can definitely see that the knob skipping issue is not a significant issue for live performance where the endless relative encoder is preferred - jumping 2 values out of 128 when making a tiny parameter adjustment probably isn't noticeable.  I think Beatstep would be quite good for that use case.  The knob issue is really only a bitch when making precise note changes in sequencer mode.

[stuey]

The knob issue is really only a bitch when making precise note changes in sequencer mode.

And I think this is only regarding VI's either in a DAW or standalone. When controlling anything hardware either Midi or CV, I can say that the knobs are very precise, each semitone can accurately be set without any jumping.

Cheers, Stuart   

[djmental]

I dunno, man, if you made you decision or not,

Thank you for your info.
I ordered it yesterday and Im supposed to get it Saturday. It will be my first Arturia
hardware and I will definitely report on my experience with it.
The shipping was super cheap and I can return it if I don't like it.

What I definitely didn't like is that a moderator erased this post.
I noticed after I made the purchase and was going to announce it here.
But I'm glad they acknowledged the bad decision and reestablished this post
after I made a post about it.

I don't get this "jumping" issue with the knobs. At least in Live I have not had
that issue with the LaunchKey knobs.
 ( LaunchKEY knobs are not endless enconders as the BeatStep's )
I have Live parameters in "pickup" mode
so the knobs don't do anything until they pick the parameter at its current value
and in the case of the LaunchKEY they do it smoothly and on 1 to 1 ratio so the
parameter rotation mimics exactly the knob rotation.

I hope Arturia continues to support this controller/sequencer.

[jsmirk]

The knob issue is really only a bitch when making precise note changes in sequencer mode.

And I think this is only regarding VI's either in a DAW or standalone. When controlling anything hardware either Midi or CV, I can say that the knobs are very precise, each semitone can accurately be set without any jumping.

Cheers, Stuart

Perhaps you got lucky and your model has flawless action in the encoders. I'm using my Beatstep directly with a Bass Station II, no DAW. Move the knob 1 precise click, note value goes up 2 semitones unpredictably and can happen on any knob. It's a hardware flaw, but again, not a problem in controller mode as far as I would be concerned there.

Thank you for your info.
I ordered it yesterday and Im supposed to get it Saturday. It will be my first Arturia
hardware and I will definitely report on my experience with it.
The shipping was super cheap and I can return it if I don't like it.

...

I don't get this "jumping" issue with the knobs. At least in Live I have not had
that issue with the LaunchKey knobs.
 ( LaunchKEY knobs are not endless enconders as the BeatStep's )
I have Live parameters in "pickup" mode
so the knobs don't do anything until they pick the parameter at its current value
and in the case of the LaunchKEY they do it smoothly and on 1 to 1 ratio so the
parameter rotation mimics exactly the knob rotation.

As noted, this potential issue is specific to the knob action on some Beatstep units and is only noticeable when in sequencer mode, not controller mode.  If your primary purpose is to use it as a controller, you will be ok.  However, I would be curious to know how accurate the knobs are in sequencer mode for you.  Maybe I got a poorly assembled unit (only the lower right quadrant of Pad 1 works on mine)

[djmental]

jmirk, thank you.

And yes, I will use it mainly as a controller
but I definetely will use the sequencer.
I plan to record loop clips of sequences
made with the beatstep.

I use Max for Live Monosequencer but although it is highly versatile its a PITA to choose notes on it and I dont know any vst step sequencer that lets you choose notes apart from Reason's Thor (And the launchPAD apps, but I dont like using pads to sequence).

btw if you use reason there is an excellent tutorial to transform the minilab which only has 8 pads, into a step sequencer with Thor. It is in spanish but you'll get the idea for the beatstep.