We've been overlooked again......

[jcotner]

Well gang I got an e-mail from Arturia announcing updates to some products.
Ta Da ----- Brass 2.0 and MiniMg 2.0
No surprise, but still nothing for MMV and Brass came out after MMV.
Woe to the poor suckers that buy a new copy of MMV thinking it's not a dead
product.
I guess it's not dead as long as people still buy it, regardless of the current
state of the software.
And I certainly don't think this post is abusive when Arturia admits there are
bugs and then turns around and says there are no plans to fix them.
At least there are no plans to fix them if no date and no resources are
assigned to fix them. The check is in the mail I'm afraid.

[Antoine]

I understand your frustration, but we would have had same complaints if we had worked on the MMV instead of the ARP2600V, the ARP2600V instead of the CS80V, and so on...

The MMV has reached version 2.2, i.e. the highest version number in Arturia range of synths as of today (AF apart), with a nice level of features and stability, and relatively low resources consuming. Sure it still have some residual bugs, as there will ever be as long as programs are coded by human beings. But you can honestly count on a maintenance update for 2009.

On the other side, Brass was stalled to a pre-VST2.4 version, and we decided to develop a severe upgrade instead of a simple maintenance update. That can be discussed, but that makes sense for us, as it certainly does for Brass users.

I cannot affirm which synthesizers will be updated (maintenance release) or upgraded (update + new features) first; all I know is that 2009 should be rich of events for our trusted and respected users, as well as for ourselves.

[Sweep]

Thanks Antoine.

And a couple of extra points from someone who uses the MMV software:

Woe to the poor suckers that buy a new copy of MMV thinking it's not a dead
product.
I guess it's not dead as long as people still buy it, regardless of the current
state of the software.

For the sake of anyone thinking of buying the Modular V: It's not a dead product at all. It works, and works beautifully. There are some minor issues (some of which have been blown out of all proportion by one of its detractors) but the main problems people report on here seem to be compatibility with third party software. Treat it like a hardware Mg Modular - play the keyboard and hook it up to a recording device - and the results are spectacular.

I use it a lot in my own music and the person I share a website with has a massive collection of MMV-based compositions available for download. It may need some updates, but `dead' certainly isn't a description that fits the facts.

I'm not saying this to criticise the person who started this topic. It's just that `dead' is one of those overstatements we can all make that can mean something else to people reading what we've said. To anyone thinking about buying the MMV I'd suggest downloading the demo. You'll soon find out if it's `dead' or not. Check out any compatibility issues people may have reported if you want to use it with third-party software, but don't be put off a brilliant instrument because there are a few problems. The original Mg Modular had problems enough, and that didn't put people like Keith Emerson and Wendy Carlos off.

[jcotner]

It is very encouraging to see a statement that an update should happen this year. It's kind of overdue. Also by dead I'm referring to support. I have done a fair amount of software development in my time and it's ususally fair in my profession to say a piece of software is dead if no longer updated. That could be said in perception or reality.

I have several pieces of software that work beautifully but aren't being updated. I certainly call those dead as well. I also have some hardware synths (Synergy, Chroma, DX1) that sound fantastic when plugged in, turned on and played; but they are also dead from a support point of view. Other than user forums, which is much as this is, and in the absence of updates for a number of years I can't call MMV an actively supported product. Maybe this perception is going to change in 2009. We'll see.

Detractor perhaps, but I worked with a Mg IIIC quite a bit and built one of the first computer controlled analog synthesizers back in the 70's. I hardly consider myself a novice at this. I expected a lot of glitches in early stuff but compared to the Native Instruments software, which I also use quite a bit, MMV just doesn't seem very polished. I'd like to use it more but my time is better spent on making music, not being Arturia's uncompensated beta tester and having to stumble around various got cha(s) in MMV. I simply cannot view this as an unreasonable position to take. One thing that might improve this situation a little bit is for Arturia to post their list of known bugs and suggested workarounds. It may be on the forum somewhere but I don't recall ever seeing it, and I'm referring to an Arturia produced list, not a bunch of user bug lists. That and of course the long awaited maintenance release of MMV.

[Sweep]

Thanks.  I thought you were probably using `dead' in a specialised sense, but I was concerned that it might not be understood that way by prospective users of the MMV.

When I referred to a specific detractor who's exaggerated problems with the MMV I certainly wasn't referring to you. The person in question actually has no experience of the Mg modular at all, though you might not realise that to hear him talk. 

It's good to have someone here with experience of the original modular, actually. On a couple of occasions I've asked people with modular experience who aren't on the forum to clarify specific points that have been raised about the MMV.

I agree with you about the value of a list of known bugs and workarounds. I think that would be an excellent idea.

BTW Antoine, on another thread a point was raised about one of the exercises in the MMV manual. Someone thought they'd found a bug, but when I checked it out it turned out to be something that wasn't quite as it should be in the manual. So as well as a list of bugs and workarounds it might be handy to have some addendas to the manual listed on the main site as well.

[jcotner]

There was a guy here named Elhardt that found a large number of little bugs and was vocal about them. He hasn't been back to the forums in a couple of years now. If I were Arturia I'd sure want him to beta test any new release of MMV because he knows the software pretty well.
If he is the same guy as Elhardt on youtube, he is certainly a very capable synthesist. His posted work is fantastic and was done on an Alesis Andromeda. I highly recommend a listen.

[jcotner]

I should also add, as I just remembered, that I have a very thick stack of paper that Tom Rhea sent to me almost thirty years ago that is a very through reference on the Mg modular machines and programming them.
I think it's still copyright protected, so I can't post it, but if anybody happens to be friends with Tom it would be great if he would give Arturia permission to post it here. I honestly don't think he would remember me and I certainly don't have any current contact information for him. Just thought I'd throw that out, just in case.

[Sweep]

There was a guy here named Elhardt...

Yes, that's him. He delights in nitpicking.

He was sent packing from the Mg forum after he launched a bizarre personal attack on someone highly respected in the business.  That was after the stuff he was posting was critically considered instead of being greeted with cries of `Oh Elhardt, you are so wise, what would we do without you' etc, which seems to be what he wants whenever he posts, so he descended to personal attacks.

I also saw some posts of his on another electronic music forum recently. Someone with the relevant knowledge and experience was posting about the use of synth technology in Yamaha organs. Elhardt came in with comments, some of which were valid and some of which weren't, but completely missed the point that was being made. As usual he was told he was nitpicking and not seeing what was actually being said.

He does have some knowledge and technical skill, but makes himself out to be far more than he is, and unfortunately people sometimes believe him. He's incredibly time-wasting if you let him be.

[jcotner]

Well I'm not going to defend him other than to say he found some bugs, I think he knows the software and he does a very good treatment of synthesized Baroque music.
Wait I think I said that already, but I can't really disagree with your assessment either.