Filter issues - audio artefacts/digital stepping/glitching

[illywhacker]

Arturias applications have variations in how smoothed the parameters are, when you control them manually with a controller. I would'nt mind, if Arturia had a look at this smoothing for all applications.

As examples: Modular V3, SEM V2, Prophet V3, CS-80 V3 and Jup-8 V3 has great smoothing, - while Mini V3, DX7 V and Matrix-12 V2 more or less is steppy like Pigments.

I agree LBH, I've noticed that the Sem, CS-80 and Jup all sound awesome to me, they are the ones I use the most. The Prophet and Mini also get used quite a lot. I'll try that trick with the modwheel and Lag next time I'm in the studio and see if it's a handy workaround for me too. I have noticed slight stepping on one or two of the synths in the V6, but it was on ones that I don't use as much and it wasn't too noticeable. Though for me, Pigments is the worst I've ever heard on any softsynth! So I'm hoping this is just something they need to address and a simple fix. As I love the sound of Pigments so far and will definitely purchase it once it's sounding good on my system.

Is anyone from Arturia reading this thread? I noticed Ben Arturia posted early on in the thread, but have no indication if they've seen these further replies?

[LBH]

@illywhacker

I think there are lots of sounds where the stepping either seems to not excist, is'nt audioble, does't matter or even add to a sound though the stepping should'nt be there either. And there are sounds where the stepping is audioble when the sound is sustained. The stepping is very audioble on the default preset, like you show with your soundfile.

Arturia staff monitor this forum if and when they can. But if you you wan't to be certain, then contacting Arturia Support is the way to go. Arturia does not answer all threads in the forums.

[illywhacker]

@LBH,

I emailed Arturia Support to draw their attention to this issue. I'll update when I hear back!

[illywhacker]

Response from Arturia Support, kudos on a quick reply from them!:

Hello.

You can hear these steps because your mouse and controller are sending 7 bits data.
The automations however send fine values.

So drawing lines in Bitwig will not result in a scaled effect, but the mouse will.

Feel free to get back to us if you need any further help

I'm going to test again with automation lines, today to see if that is the case. I'm certain I tested this and still experienced stepping. I'll double check this and update.

[Biome Digital]

I've just done a filter sweep in Reaper using Reaper's automation and it was smooth. Does that help at all? I did try all lowpass filter modes.

[RomusD]

MIDI CC data only have a resolution of 7Bit 0-127.
Automation data in the DAW, if not based on a MIDI CC data parameter, are finer!

Test with SEM V in comparison to pigments. Both synths have a Saw Wafeform and an LP SEM filter with 66% resonance.

Test 1:
I have defined a tone with a MIDI CC Data Automation from 0 to 127 and back to 0.
With SEM V the filter sweep is soft.
With pigments, the artifacts are well audible.

Test 2:
I have defined a tone with a DAW automation on the filter frequency from 0 to 1 and back to 0.
With SEM V the filter sweep is soft.
With Pigments the filter sweep is now also soft.

Parameter control via the Keylab mkII only with MIDI CC data so no "analog-Feeling" on!
It would be desirable for pigments to behave the same as SEM V.

[illywhacker]

Thanks for the replies guys.

Arturia have sent it on to their testing and development team to figure out why it's glitching and adding artefacts so badly. After I sent them the test project in Bitwig 2.0, they said they could not hear artefacts on their computers. Though the test recording I did on MY computer demonstrated to them that there is an issue. So they're looking into it. Adjusting Filter Freq with all methods (mouse, Keylab controls, automation drawn in on Bitwig), all create artefacts.

I've not heard back from them since they informed me they have forwarded it onto their development team, so I assume they've not identified the issue yet. I didn't purchase Pigments in the end. I'll try the demo in a month or two to see if it's been fixed. Though it's a shame to miss out on the reduced introductory price for existing customers. So I'm not sure whether I'll proceed with purchasing Pigments yet, as I get by with Omnisphere and the V6 collection.

   

[ben arturia]

Hi all,
After further investigations it looks like it's related with the buffer size used.
With a big buffer size you might experience high stepping effect.

Could you please try with 32/64 buffer size ?

We are working on that point right now.

[LBH]

Hi Ben.

To give you feedback. I have tried to test.

It make no difference for me to set lower buffer. Still stepping on 64 and 32 samples buffer.

(The stepping is only an issue when using a assigned controller knob or fader in a live or recording  performance)

Perhaps this indicate where to look for a solution for stepping in applications:

Arturias applications have variations in how smoothed the parameters are, when you control them manually with a controller. I would'nt mind, if Arturia had a look at this smoothing for all applications.
As examples: Modular V3, SEM V2, Prophet V3, CS-80 V3 and Jup-8 V3 has great smoothing, - while Mini V3, DX7 V and Matrix-12 V2 more or less is steppy like Pigments.
But if one for example use Modwheel controlled Lag generator for the Cutoff in Matrix 12 V2, then the stepping (quantizing?) can be smoothed out.
And Mini V3 has no stepping when for example using Modwheel to control Cutoff thru the Modulation Matrix.

Best
LBH.

[Razzia]

Chiming in to say that this is happening to me as well, but only in the VST3 version. I could probably live with avoiding the VST3, for a while, but hopefully this gets identified and fixed eventually


Windows 10
Ableton Live 10.1
i7 6700k/integrated graphics
16GB RAM
250GB SSD/2TB HDD


It only happens with the mouse. Modulators are fine. Automation lanes, fine. Ableton Push 2 and Launchkey, also fine. Interestingly, if I use a macro to control the filter cutoff it even looks steppy in the macro's visualiation window. And again, not the case with the VST2 version.

edit: how long do I have to do these capchas and quizzes every time I want to do something on here? Hopefully there's a minimum post requirement that gets rid of this. I have to google vintage synthesizers just to edit my post...

[OBCS80]

Chiming in to say that this is happening to me as well, but only in the VST3 version. I could probably live with avoiding the VST3, for a while, but hopefully this gets identified and fixed eventually


Windows 10
Ableton Live 10.1
i7 6700k/integrated graphics
16GB RAM
250GB SSD/2TB HDD


It only happens with the mouse. Modulators are fine. Automation lanes, fine. Ableton Push 2 and Launchkey, also fine. Interestingly, if I use a macro to control the filter cutoff it even looks steppy in the macro's visualiation window. And again, not the case with the VST2 version.

edit: how long do I have to do these capchas and quizzes every time I want to do something on here? Hopefully there's a minimum post requirement that gets rid of this. I have to google vintage synthesizers just to edit my post...

Same, this is not fixed, very steppy in the VST3 version (as seen as well when using a macro knob on the cutoff filter. Working fine and smooth in the VST 2 one.