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Author Topic: KE9 3rd Impression sound: Can this be programmed on the MatrixBrute?  (Read 3352 times)

RobyD

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Hello all!
I am new to the wonders of the MatrixBrute  (just purchased it) and wondering if the synth sound on ELP's Karn Evil 9 3rd Impression synth sound can be accomplished on the MB. It can be heard at the :45 second mark on this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wz6Mj8cROJw

I would love to be able to pull this off with the MB, but have NO experience in patching/routing modules.
Thank you in advance for any help and input... :)

Chromat1c

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Re: KE9 3rd Impression sound: Can this be programmed on the MatrixBrute?
« Reply #1 on: March 05, 2019, 04:35:43 pm »
Try a SAW into the Ladder add some resonance. perhaps use the mod wheel to wangle the filter cutoff.
Add some envelope to the filter. Sounds like an easy sound to make , pretty basic.

You want to learn the basics of subtractive synthesis then you will find it easy.

turbo_kev

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Re: KE9 3rd Impression sound: Can this be programmed on the MatrixBrute?
« Reply #2 on: March 05, 2019, 07:05:21 pm »
Im sure there are quite a few MxB new owners
that would love lo learn the basics of subtractive  synthesis

I am one of them

I have all these elp, tangerine dream, tonto expanding head band
sounds in my head

and I haven't got a clue where to start

Where does one go to learn the skills
you tube  web sites  etc wetc

suggestions please

cheers
kev
BWS 3.0.0,Spark LE, V Collection 6.2, BS1 & BS PRO, Keystep & Keystep pro  keylab 25, Axiom pro 49,Behringer UMC1820,Launch pad pro,ProFx8 v2,Icon m+ & D2,KRK 10/3,win 10 pro,i7 5820k 4ghz ,16G ddr 4 ,1TB NVMe.M2, msi x99a sli + , NV GF Gt 710, Matrix Brute  Roland TR8S

Major Kong

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Re: KE9 3rd Impression sound: Can this be programmed on the MatrixBrute?
« Reply #3 on: April 07, 2019, 09:54:02 am »
and I haven't got a clue where to start

Try this series of articles: https://www.soundonsound.com/techniques/synth-secrets-all-63-parts-sound-on-sound

The trick with subtractive synthesis is that you have to have a conceptual understanding of what the different blocks do, and how they can cooperate and there is really no shurtcut to this, but to read, listen and experiment.

DrJustice

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Re: KE9 3rd Impression sound: Can this be programmed on the MatrixBrute?
« Reply #4 on: April 07, 2019, 12:48:35 pm »
Marc Doty  as a tutorial series where he goes through the MatrixBrute in detail: MatrixBrute: Tutorials by Marc Doty.

It's perhaps more an overview of the synth than a synthesis tutorial, but may be useful anyway if you're learning, especially alongside a synthesis tutorial such as the SOS one mentioned by Major Kong.

turbo_kev

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Re: KE9 3rd Impression sound: Can this be programmed on the MatrixBrute?
« Reply #5 on: April 07, 2019, 02:05:58 pm »
Hi   it looks like that sos has removed the article from the web site

so here is a link to the complete series in pdf format

I hope this helps

cheers
kev
http://www.mediafire.com/file/7w2dcsqmkbeduea/Synth+Secrets+Complete.pdf
BWS 3.0.0,Spark LE, V Collection 6.2, BS1 & BS PRO, Keystep & Keystep pro  keylab 25, Axiom pro 49,Behringer UMC1820,Launch pad pro,ProFx8 v2,Icon m+ & D2,KRK 10/3,win 10 pro,i7 5820k 4ghz ,16G ddr 4 ,1TB NVMe.M2, msi x99a sli + , NV GF Gt 710, Matrix Brute  Roland TR8S

Major Kong

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Re: KE9 3rd Impression sound: Can this be programmed on the MatrixBrute?
« Reply #6 on: April 07, 2019, 03:58:33 pm »
it looks like that sos has removed the article from the web site

Ah, no. Not at all. The articles are still there.

Under the picture there is a caption that reads "All 63 Parts of Gordon Reid's classic SYNTH SECRETS series are now all available on our site: listed here." -- the words listed here are a link to a search of all articles from the SoS site.

For clarity, the link refers to: https://www.soundonsound.com/search/articles/%22Synth%20Secrets%22?solrsort=ds_created%20asc&f%5B0%5D=im_field_subject%3A8106


Chromat1c

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Re: KE9 3rd Impression sound: Can this be programmed on the MatrixBrute?
« Reply #7 on: April 10, 2019, 04:38:18 pm »
To sum up the very basics of subtractive synthesis.
You start off with an oscillator with say a SAW wave. This gives you a stack of harmonics.
Next this goes into a filter where you can "subtract" these harmonics by setting the "filter cutoff"
Then into an amplifier....
So Oscillator>Filter>Amp

Each of these can have their values changed over time using modulators i.e LFOs Envelope generators or even other oscillators.
So you start off with a sound that is harmonically rich and then "subtract" from and "modulate" it.

The opposite would be Additive synthesis. Any waveform can be recreated by adding a number of sine waves with different pitches and amplitudes together.

Chromat1c

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Re: KE9 3rd Impression sound: Can this be programmed on the MatrixBrute?
« Reply #8 on: April 10, 2019, 04:55:08 pm »

Where does one go to learn the skills
you tube  web sites  etc wetc

suggestions please

cheers
kev

Well lets go back a bit first. I think that learning about "simple harmonic motion" will help. For example if you twang a guitar string you have at the bottom the "fundamental" the key of the note. Then there is usually a gap of one octave before the first harmonic after which all the other harmonics follow. They tend to get more tightly spaced as you go higher. Now strangely if you filter out the fundamental your brain still knows what note the sound is!
If I remember right a saw wave has even or all harmonics and a square wave has odd numbered harmonics giving different timbres. A square wave sounds a bit like a clarinet and a saw more brassy.

Friske

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Re: KE9 3rd Impression sound: Can this be programmed on the MatrixBrute?
« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2019, 09:05:19 am »
To RobyD, turbo_kev and other people interested in learning the basics, have you heard of Syntorial? It's a crash course to learn the basis of subtractive synthesis by following step-by-step lessons. I've enjoyed it very much!

I'll post my affiliate link here..and feel free to do what you want with it -Syntorial

 :-*
"The computer can't tell you the emotional story. It can give you the exact mathematical design, but what's missing is the eyebrows." - Zappa

Chromat1c

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Re: KE9 3rd Impression sound: Can this be programmed on the MatrixBrute?
« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2019, 09:39:25 am »
The thing that has helped me more than anything is understanding that we are "synthesising" sound and so understand ing how THAT behaves and is created in the real world is really helpful. This is an interesting link that covers simple harmonic motion. There are links to its relation to sound from this page http://www.animations.physics.unsw.edu.au/waves-sound/oscillations/index.html

That is the absolute basics and not the whole study of sound. Its like banging a drum or twanging a string hitting a rock against another rock. Next you can start thinking about its relation to acoustic resonance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acoustic_resonance
then put the two together!

Great links. I am still learning after 30 years of this!

Friske

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Re: KE9 3rd Impression sound: Can this be programmed on the MatrixBrute?
« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2019, 11:54:14 am »
Very nice! I'll definitely have a look at this Chromat1c  8)
"The computer can't tell you the emotional story. It can give you the exact mathematical design, but what's missing is the eyebrows." - Zappa

 

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