Waveform select and other controls not visible to host automation?

[Rob Roff]

This is a bit disappointing. I went to top map out the miniMg V(2) to a novation automap template and I can't assign the waveform selector knob. This is one of the first things you go to tweak when making a patch. Every other soft synth I have that uses a dial or drop down menu for a waveform selector can have this assigned to hardware.

Also, I notice that the mod matrix sources and destinations also can't be assigned, or the various switches on the miniMg V.
Is this something that can be changed? One of my biggest reasons for wanting the Arturia emulations was to recreate the layouts on my midi control surface (Remote SL in my case), to use them much like their hardware equivalents. But Arturia leaves out many parameters from being able to be mapped. The Prophet VS has the same problem with the mod amounts (can't be assigned), which is even worse.

Is this something can be changed? I'd really like to have as much hardware control as possible.
thanks,

Rob

[Antoine]

A [Command+click] (or [Ctrl+click] under Windows) on the Waveform selector should do the trick. You can assign the pulse width the same way.
And the modulation amounts can be tweaked through host automation.

[Rob Roff]

A [Command+click] (or [Ctrl+click] under Windows) on the Waveform selector should do the trick. You can assign the pulse width the same way.
And the modulation amounts can be tweaked through host automation.

How can the modulation amounts be tweaked through host automation? In ableton, they do not appear for automation. Also, they can not be assigned to Kore knobs (which reallies on parameters being visible host automation), also when I configure the order of plug-in parameters in Ableton Live, the mod amounts do not show up when I touch/adjust them. Also, when I set up a novation automap template, these mod amounts can not be assigned. Same problem with the buttons on prophet (like waveform selectors), the buttons on the CS-80V, and many of it's dials, the Jupiter 8V buttons and waveform selector and pretty much all the Arturia buttons and some dials. Can't map any of these out. How should right-click help this? I will try when I get home, but unless there is so kind of "enable automation", I'm not sure if this will help.

thanks

[Rob Roff]

Hi Antoine,

I tried the command-click method and that only works for manual midi cc assigning. I am talking about assigning parameters to hosts/plug-in shells that really on those parameters being visible to host automation directly. Examples are Novation automap, NI Kore 2, and Ableton Live 8 plug-in configuration. These do not use manual midi cc. They read the parameters the same way a host would read the parameters. Do you have any of these to test with? Other hosts probably do automation the same way though. This is a pretty important issue, and unfortunately Arturia seems to be the only plug-ins where many parameters aren't visible to host automation. It's a problem with all 6 in the collection. Many parameters on the synths are not accessible and none of the switches or buttons are. We can discuss it further by email if you like?

thanks,
Rob

[Antoine]

How can the modulation amounts be tweaked through host automation? In ableton, they do not appear for automation.

Yes they can, but you must first activate the Modulation Matrix, clicking on the appropriate button on the tool bar.

And yes, some of the parameters are not assignable, as the oscillators switches or range pots; we shall probably let'em be freely assignable in next update.

For the rest, I have to grab some deeper technical elements from the Developers Crypt.

[Rob Roff]

Thanks for looking into that Antoine. I don't know if you guys have Kore 2 or a Remote SL to test with, but that would be ideal. I am able to assign pulse width to these, but not waveform select. Also, pulse width shows very erratic behavior when learned to novation automap or kore. It moves, but always bounces back to half. Perhaps because it shares a control with waveform shape, not sure.

I should clarify as well that I know the mod amounts in MiniMg V can be controlled by host automation. My original post was actually talking about the Prophet VS mod amounts. I should have left that out of this discussion about the miniMg, sorry. I'll try activating the Prophet VS mod matrix later today. In my experience so far though, activating a control does not make it visible to host automation when it wasn't already.

cheers
and thanks for the support on this

[Rob Roff]

Antoine, I posted regarding the prophet V back on it's own thread here: http://www.arturia.com/evolution/smf/index.php?topic=2837.0

It's the same problem of the controls not being available, but I thought I would keep the prophet mod matrix discussion out of this one to avoid confusion.

[Undercoverman]

I desperately want this to be available, Antoine!

I will move mountains if that's what it will take! Have a look at this project I've got set up, just so I can adjust all of Prophet V's parameters...

I wrote this regarding the Prophet V, which I own as well as the miniMg V, but it is applicable to both!

At the moment I've currently got a set up in Cubase (5) where all available automation that can be assigned is mapped to my Behringer BCR2000, so I have dynamic LED feedback from the Prophet V. I did this in the 'Generic Remote' section, with (switchable) presets for each instance of Prophet V (I like to run more than one, YMO style!). The only thing lacking is any of the push-buttons - as discussed, I cannot map these using any form of VST automation.

Instead, I've had to resort to mapping the push-buttons to MIDI (with the Ctrl-Click command), then controlling these MIDI aspects with Cubase's built in 'Quick Control' function (assigned to CCs), as mapped and monitored through the Generic Remote (they're available under 'Mixer').

The problems with this are; you can only have 8 quick controls per track, so I have to have 3 midi tracks per Prophet V instance (it's getting complicated!), all in a folder. I have a total of 18 unmapped buttons on the BCR2000, so that necessitates the 3 tracks. One MIDI track controls the first 8 Quick Controls and notes played, the other two are the second 8 and last 2 respectively. When recording, I have to arm all three, and cannot look at automation data for these controls without opening each up and looking at the MIDI (which is descibed according to CC, not the parameter it changes in Prophet V).

The final problem is the most severe. Because changing patch does not execute a MIDI dump, all MIDI mapped controls have to be re-entered manually on the controller to have it update and reflect the different parameters. In effect, I have to enter each patch manually from the display. This, of course, does not happen with the automation commands visible, as mapped on the BCR2000, as they automatically update upon a patch change! Oh, and setting each track up like this, even with saved track presets, takes a huge amount of time!

So please Antoine, can you make the VST automation for these parameters available as an update for the Prophet V?

And I realise it is a big ask, but please, please, please can you do this for each of Arturia's synths?

Words could not express my gratitude if this can be done!

[Rob Roff]

Yes, exactly!

In a nutshell, could you please please make all buttons automatable on all 6 synths, as well as all knobs or sliders that are not currently (like the miniMg waveform knob and the ARP 2600 oscillator octave sliders and the prophet's mod amounts etc etc.).

Undercoverman and I are looking for exaclt the same thing. He uses Cubases internal mapping based on host automation parameters and I use Kore, Novation Automap and Ableton plug-in configuration, which all also rely on host automation parameters. Generic midi mapping is nowhere near as powerful and has many negatives, as mentioned.

Arturia synths rock, but my dream is to actually be able to map them out entirely, like I can with my many other synths.

thanks!

[jjstyles]

I would also like to encourage Arturia to make ALL controls on all 6 synths assignable! Please!

[Antoine]

Currently working on all synths updates, we are studying feasibility of such feature implementation. More news to come.

[Undercoverman]

Excellent, thank you for looking into this Antoine.

[Rob Roff]

Glad to hear you guys are checking into it. Many thanks Antoine!

It would be great for Arturia to catch up to the industry status quo in this regard, as currently it is the major downside of using an Arturia synth (but they sound amazing). I have dozens of other commercial and free synths and pretty well every one can have their buttons and selectors mapped to host automation controls. Most can also map drop-down menus like mod matrix source and destinations selectors. For examples, you can look into synths such as Sylenth1, Poly-Ana, Zebra 2, ABL Pro, Gladiator 2, Pro-53, impOscar, Oddity, Minimonsta, etc. for examples of how this should work.

Thanks! 

[Rob Roff]

Currently working on all synths updates, we are studying feasibility of such feature implementation. More news to come.

Any progress being made on this issue for all the V2 updates this summer Antoine? So many people have brought up the same problem to me. I think it's THE improvement that would make a world of difference to many people.

cheers!

[Rob Roff]

Currently working on all synths updates, we are studying feasibility of such feature implementation. More news to come.

Well half the line is updated and no change to any of them with this problem. Is this bad news then?