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Author Topic: Alternative concept of Interface (man/machine)  (Read 18071 times)

fin

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Alternative concept of Interface (man/machine)
« Reply #15 on: November 26, 2007, 12:08:04 am »
Just my opinion. Putting aside weather its intuitive or not, still think it would not be a very good design choice to put what was once a full size large hardware poly synth onto a 12 inch touch screen. A 12 inch touch screen is, well, a 12 inch touch screen and a CS-80 is a CS-80. Don't see any need to try and mix the two. It would be akin to Apple putting one of those old fashioned spinning ring dialers as the main way of making a phone call on the iphone.

slammah2012

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Alternative concept of Interface (man/machine)
« Reply #16 on: November 26, 2007, 01:25:11 am »
Pip
I don't work for Vax..... or "Infinite Response"...
However Vax will work for me....as a performer
The Origin is supposed  to respond to Polyphonic aftertouch according to Vincent, Yet I have seen no printed claims to that
 effect and the vids serve no clue as if it does....

However unfortunate, the Origin Keyboard may only be manufactured with channel Aftertouch because Fatar
 (Arturias supposed supplier) does not know how to build a cost effective key bed with PolyAT...

I sent Fredric Brun and Vincent, the news of this new manufacturer,
"Infinite Response" to give them the good news in their quest for a
 good keybed...
Hopefully this new manufacturer is a cause for delay in the keyboard version release....given that Arturia also gave notice to the importance
of the CS80 Ribbon....as seen on the Origin KBD version
Finally, There is a builder that makes these Poly AT boards again....
And Origin will be so much better with it...
Sorry again for being on topic.....

slammah2012

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Alternative concept of Interface (man/machine)
« Reply #17 on: November 26, 2007, 01:47:45 am »
Quote from: "fin"
Just my opinion. Putting aside weather its intuitive or not, still think it would not be a very good design choice to put what was once a full size large hardware poly synth onto a 12 inch touch screen. A 12 inch touch screen is, well, a 12 inch touch screen and a CS-80 is a CS-80. Don't see any need to try and mix the two. It would be akin to Apple putting one of those old fashioned spinning ring dialers as the main way of making a phone call on the iphone.


Yes I see what you are saying, but why are "you" limiting the screen size
to 12 inches???
I currently have a 17 inch phillips touchScreen monitor that is 8 years old for my VSTs, and I can physically control
all individual controls a mouse can , but only one touch at a time as that is what technology offered.....

I have seen touch surface bars... on the internet...twelve feet long...all multiple touch....
Why use the "Mackie" approach of minimalization of a work area down to 18"x18"....considering the general population is fatter than it used to be...(being blunt here)...
and use a pro point of view, with a large usable workspace....and leave the iphone gear for Mr Speedy thumbs and his intuitive text messages.....so his deal can go through in the donut shop parking lot....
What is wrong with having a large 48"x 24" Multi-Touchscreen that folds in half where you not only control knobs ,
switches and faders, but also ribbon and a 3 dimensional playing surface like the continuum?....
Is the topic of this thread not based on "Alternative ways that man and machine could communicate"???
Quote
Alternative concept of Interface (man/machine)
I still view poly AT as an alternative to main stream....as I also view the
Haken "Continuum" ... and Kyma and Lemur are  stepping stones to what I would
like to see....

Teuf

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Alternative concept of Interface (man/machine)
« Reply #18 on: November 26, 2007, 10:06:33 am »
Quote from: "slammah2012"
I have a touch screen. You are limited to one touch at a time...
I-phone, I-pod touch and now notebook DELL come with multiple touch ... it the (close) next standard.

Quote
(...)..it would be very expensive
Probably in a first time, as was DVD burners, touch screen and each new technologies...
What is important is the "fickleness" to "perennialize" (thanks babelfish translator :mrgreen:) the produce

Quote
an expense I would rather pay
 on a good polyphonic aftertouch Keyboard for its contol features....
Yessss Agree with you, I think Aftertouch is a very iimportant modulation controller often forget (try the very bad AT on the Triton Studio ou OASYS :-( or the few sounds who use AT on workstations or synth ...why ?!?)
Thanks to point this  :-D

Quote
BTW , have I mentioned the VAX77 ???
I already seen this link  :D verry impressive in add.
I
Quote
will embrace a multi pressure, multiple touch screen, if it also includes an integrated playing surface that can double up as a secondary playing surface, like the continuum does in hardware form..... and at the same time allows the grabbing of multiple sliders and knobs on a virtual canvas, and maybe by then, you will make me reconsider the true king of keyboards.....
It interest me too
Quote
A real Yamaha CS80.... and no touch surface will help recreate the original sound with out the poly AT board.
Yes, but you can use the keyboard you want with this expender.
This thread talk about interface to navigate easily between synthesis, modules, and parameters :)
The goal is to acceded to the whole parameters. All before the eyes and all under the finger, no more, no less I don't speak about keyboards,
only intuitive interface. for us !

@+
Teuf :)

Teuf

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Alternative concept of Interface (man/machine)
« Reply #19 on: November 26, 2007, 10:12:11 am »
Quote from: "Pip"
Teuf
You are right - I've recently got a touch screen phone - but it's still 1 to 2 years before we really see this tech all over the place. I Have an M3 with a touch screen and it's wonderful - all new synths will have this tech in the future.(...)

May the thruth be with you you... ahem...Pip

Dell just begin to sell multipoint touch screen notebook... wait and see.

Have you read and undestant the second concept with electo-magntic technologie and movable controllers on the screen ?
This could be very useful and handy, isn't it ?

Teuf

Teuf

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Alternative concept of Interface (man/machine)
« Reply #20 on: November 26, 2007, 10:57:13 am »
Quote from: "fin"
The concept of a multi touch interface on a hardware synth is really really interesting, but with the above concept there is I think a fundamental flaw, which is why put the interface of a hardware analog synth from the 70's on a instrument in 2008.

These are only exemples on the 3D models...you use the synthesis, emulations or modules you want.
If you want emulate the CS80 it could be nice to use the original interface...but if you want create a new kind of syhthesis with different patched modules you can do it too.
Two words : "fickle" and "handy"
What is te flaw ? :-)
Quote

If the sound was going to be the same, why would you present the user it with the old synths interface, which were badly designed to being with (CS80 is the most unintuative synth ever created!).
What would be interesting is if modern interface techniques were applied, like on the ipod/iphone virtual keyboard, where sliders zoom underneath the finger when touched.
I don't know this unintuative interface from CS80...If you are right, why not !!
I'm agree with you to give a best graphic interface :D
OK !
Consider it was only a 3D model to explain the layout and the relation between graphic / touch screen / controllers and displays ;-)


Quote
Another basic example is the Mg Modulars sequencer, why would you want to reproduce that monster
Yes, yes you're right.
I used what I had under the hand...sorry !
I basically used Arturia's graphic interface from their emulations :?
Quote

when you can have something like a lemur style clean and clean vertical slider version.
Who ever brings out something like this, they won't be putting 1970's hardware modelled interface on it
OK  :)
I'm not an ARTURA ingeneer ... not an ingeneer anyway ... just a CAD drawer in building who play keyboards  :wink:

Quote
still think it would not be a very good design choice to put what was once a full size large hardware poly synth onto a 12 inch touch screen.
Why ? Because of the dimensions between big hardware synth and 12.1" (or bigger) touch screen ?
I'm not very agree :-S If you can condense the informations and interface on a 12.1" why do not ?
Anolog pieces needed a lot of places but now the technologie can reduce this place. you just have to use an interface scaled with human fingers (the less we can do) Why wasting the space or use boring up/down pages on little LCD screen ?
What wast of space and wast of time with gear of the 20 last years !!

If I share my ideas it's not to play teacher but to think about together and move in a good direction :-)

...and Sorry for my poor english language :oops: what a hard exercice...it's alredy hard in french...sometime LOL

Best regards and later
Teuf :-)

Teuf

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Alternative concept of Interface (man/machine)
« Reply #21 on: November 26, 2007, 11:43:42 am »
Quote
but why are "you" limiting the screen size
to 12 inches???
I currently have a 17 inch phillips touchScreen monitor that is 8 years old for my VSTs, and I can physically control
all individual controls a mouse can , but only one touch at a time as that is what technology offered.....

I have seen touch surface bars... on the internet...twelve feet long...all multiple touch....
Why use the "Mackie" approach of minimalization of a work area down to 18"x18"....considering the general population is fatter than it used to be...(being blunt here)...
and use a pro point of view, with a large usable workspace....and leave the iphone gear for Mr Speedy thumbs and his intuitive text messages.....so his deal can go through in the donut shop parking lot....
What is wrong with having a large 48"x 24" Multi-Touchscreen that folds in half where you not only control knobs ,
switches and faders, but also ribbon and a 3 dimensional playing surface like the continuum?....
Is the topic of this thread not based on "Alternative ways that man and machine could communicate"???
Quote
Alternative concept of Interface (man/machine)
I still view poly AT as an alternative to main stream....as I also view the
Haken "Continuum" ... and Kyma and Lemur are  stepping stones to what I would
like to see....
Of course you are right. I only choice to use the same size than the ORIGIN rack.

I already try to draw someting else with bigger screen :
an half 16/9 screen in fact  :roll: but it was a keyboard...


And the other reason why I draw a 12" screen is because I know this screen and I can try it myself :



And it's no so little if the layouts on the sceen are optimized.
For you, what are the minimal size, the maximum size and the optimum size for this kind of screen ?

Later
Teuf

johnnyz

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Alternative concept of Interface (man/machine)
« Reply #22 on: December 04, 2007, 03:04:09 am »
Quote from: "coolcat"
With a big touchscreen, you won't be needing any hardware knobs. You can control everything from the screen, just like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbqS9x7sBZA&feature=related

I think it won't be long before we start seeing these type of synths.
- Menno
What do you think of a control surface like the reactable?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0h-RhyopUmc

john bowen

Teuf

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Alternative concept of Interface (man/machine)
« Reply #23 on: December 04, 2007, 10:34:39 am »
With reactable do you need one module for each parameter ?
What does it matter if the synthesis is complicated ?

Teuf

coolcat

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Alternative concept of Interface (man/machine)
« Reply #24 on: December 05, 2007, 02:17:50 am »
Quote from: "johnnyz"
What do you think of a control surface like the reactable?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0h-RhyopUmc

john bowen


Hi John,

Yeah, the reactable looks very interesting. It opens up
new intuitive ways of creating sound and music.

Great to see all of the R&D in this area being done right now.

When you watch this clip you know that Minority Report is right
around the corner:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=muibPAUvOXk#

Maybe your next synth will be the 'Holaris', with holographic
interface of course  :wink:


- Menno Meijer

Teuf

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Alternative concept of Interface (man/machine)
« Reply #25 on: April 25, 2008, 11:01:29 am »
pics came back  :D

Teuf

omissis

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Alternative concept of Interface (man/machine)
« Reply #26 on: April 25, 2008, 07:24:19 pm »
Quote from: "fin"
(CS80 is the most unintuative synth ever created!).


WHAT (Laurie, did you read that?) ????????

And, fin, what about Oberheim's Matrix-12 interface????




or DX-7?





really performance-friendly, isn't it?


























 :roll:
Max

a CS-80Vist

Teuf

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Re: Alternative concept of Interface (man/machine)
« Reply #27 on: June 12, 2008, 09:54:59 am »
Wow...a new forum :-)
Ootch !  Huh No so handy to view pics  Undecided

Teuf

mikehuckaby

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Re: Alternative concept of Interface (man/machine)
« Reply #28 on: November 01, 2008, 08:17:44 am »
killer face plate designs.  id like to have an alternative face plate after seeing this,

mike

 

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